Wait, what? - Guild Wars Forums

The Titan · May 14, 2007, 06:50 PM // 18:50

Hi there, I'm a long time lurker first time poster, this is going to be a short post as I'm not really good at long speeches.

I've had Guild wars since release i quit after i completed it, I got into Factions beta and didn't like it at all.

I was a pretty good player back then but now I'm washed up.

I've started an Ele/MO and finding it fun to play GW once again (Still only first game)

My real question is, what does it take to be a good player?

I personally find this game to be very much harder to master then WoW.

Oh and, I'm looking for somebody that can actually teach me how to play better, so if you can help please reply here.

Thanks.

Brother Andicus · May 14, 2007, 07:00 PM // 19:00

Being good at PvE doesn't really take much effort.

Here's some basics.
A) Use the radar to gague what you are likely to agro. Don't over agro.
B) Learn to kite. If a melee monster is hitting on you, don't think "The monk can heal me". Start running.
C) Think about what you want to achieve with your skillbar. Its very easy to lose sight of your objective and invest in too many attribute lines.
D) Learn about as many skills in the game as you can. The more you know, the more it can be used to your advantage.
E) No matter how good it may look, dont use mending.

Narcism · May 14, 2007, 07:06 PM // 19:06

dont' be fixated on a certain skill combo/attribute/primary/secondary. or else you end up like the people in the soul reaping nerf thread.

Astro Pubes · May 14, 2007, 07:06 PM // 19:06

Guild Wars was intended to be a more complex game than WoW.

The creaters of GW made it a point that Skill>Time Grinding, but in all honesty you have to grind in GW to become a decent player and to understand the basic concepts of the game.

I've been playing since release of Prophecies and tbh, it took me about 8 months before I even considered myself a decent player, now I like good challenges that press my game play even further.

Some will say that the fastest way to understand the skill "synergy" and the way skill chains will work is to play PvP, which is in ways correct you'll learn how to properly chain skills to optimize their usage with one another. TBH, hardcore PvPers can make up some pretty crazy builds that work well and compliment each other.

But, there are many PvEer's out there that have also figured out the skill "synergy" and they have created builds that work well against certain areas of the games, these builds are considered "Farming Builds". These players are also top notch build creaters, the ones that actually make the build.

To answer your question about what it takes to be a good player...

Time spent, Time played, do some research on builds, try out some already proven builds, try to create your own builds.

I'm by no means claiming to know everything about the game, as every day i'm learning more and more myself and I have ~3800hours in 24 months under my belt. But if you want to be a good player, the best bet is to get in with good players and learn, do your homework on builds, find flaws with builds find skills that you can substitute into the build to make it better, and mostly, just play and have fun. Playing to have fun is what makes great players.

Also, you might not have liked Factions, but now there's Nightfall. Of the 2 games I'd recommend Nightfall to you. But if you ever plan on becoming a competitive PvPer, I'd suggest to you no matter how much you didn't like Factions, to still consider buying it either via the online store *PvP edition* or going to your local game retailer and buying it from there.

My $.02

lyra_song · May 14, 2007, 07:09 PM // 19:09

Try everything. Explore. Experiment. Fail. Try again.

Then you see how the game behaves, what works, what doesnt.

I think all it takes to become a good player is the effort and willingness to learn.

The Titan · May 14, 2007, 07:35 PM // 19:35

Quote:

Originally Posted by Brother Andicus

Being good at PvE doesn't really take much effort.

Here's some basics.
A) Use the radar to gague what you are likely to agro. Don't over agro.
B) Learn to kite. If a melee monster is hitting on you, don't think "The monk can heal me". Start running.
C) Think about what you want to achieve with your skillbar. Its very easy to lose sight of your objective and invest in too many attribute lines.
D) Learn about as many skills in the game as you can. The more you know, the more it can be used to your advantage.
E) No matter how good it may look, dont use mending.

In respone to this post

Point A: So there is agro in this game then, I was wondering because on my Paladin i never lost it (W/Mo)

Point B: Being a fire mage i do most of my damage close range, Phoniex(?), Lava font, etc.

Point C: I want to achive nuke damage, killing stuff fast and not really bothering about anything else, thus is what i did in WoW it will be different here i guess.

Point D: This is where i went wrong with my W/mo after i completed the game i really just stopped playing, there where not enough players around back then.

Point E: . nuff said.

Also, if any guild would take my in I'd be happy, I'm on the American servers using the name "Flame Of The Titan" Or "Might of the Titan(s)"

Sofonisba · May 14, 2007, 08:55 PM // 20:55

Quote:

Originally Posted by The Titan

Point B: Being a fire mage i do most of my damage close range, Phoniex(?), Lava font, etc.

Point C: I want to achive nuke damage, killing stuff fast and not really bothering about anything else, thus is what i did in WoW it will be different here i guess.

B. A fire mage can do massive amounts of damage at close range, it's true. However, you will quickly earn the ire of the monks whose job it is to keep your sorry butt alive as you Leeroy into mobs.

I use close-range damage spells for defensive use only. You are not a tank. (Unless you're an earth ele, then maybe.

)

C. All Andicus was saying, was not to spread yourself (read: your attribute points) too thin. If you're e/mo, don't try to spread out over Energy Storage, Fire, Healing, and Smiting all at once. Two to three attributes to put your points in would be ideal.

Antheus · May 15, 2007, 02:48 AM // 02:48

Quote:

Point A: So there is agro in this game then, I was wondering because on my Paladin i never lost it (W/Mo)

Mobs will agro if you enter within range. Who they attack after that is beyond your control, unless you block them, knock them down, etc. There is no agro skills.

Quote:

Point B: Being a fire mage i do most of my damage close range, Phoniex(?), Lava font, etc.

Caster + melee range = death. If casters get into melee range, you've already lost. You might survive the easy missions, but overall it's a bad sign. Especially as fire. Earth is the only spec suitable for reliable melee tanking (Obsidian tank). Others aren't.

Quote:

Point C: I want to achive nuke damage, killing stuff fast and not really bothering about anything else, thus is what i did in WoW it will be different here i guess.

There's more than enough mobs that can outheal any DPS you can throw at them. Bosses doubly so.

Utility, shutdown, interrupts, degen, prioritization - that is what makes killing fast, not dps. In WoW, every class does exactly the same damage - it only depends on level difference between you and the mob. As such, ele is somewhat boring to play. It's pure DPS, and without proper support has hard time dealing with many mobs.

Quote:

Point D: This is where i went wrong with my W/mo after i completed the game i really just stopped playing, there where not enough players around back then.

In my experience, Warrior is by far the easiest to play in PvE, and elementalist the hardest.

Unfortunately, player population has only gone to worse since introduction of heroes, where most simply prefer to play with custom builds, rather than rely on PUGs.

So unless you own nightfall, you're missing out on a lot.

Kuldebar Valiturus · May 15, 2007, 04:39 AM // 04:39

Guild Wars PvE combat dynamics differ from every online game I have ever played. Not saying there aren't correlations but PvE Combat is paced and conducted very differently in Guild Wars. I remember the the learning curve I under went in Prophecies after coming over from DAoC, Horizons and WoW.

The Skales would pile up on me and seemingly "call" for help from other clumps of skales in the area. It's all about intersecting circles of influence and how wide those circles may be. The radar map, of course, helps out tremendously but when combat starts mobs move and combat area drifts.

In most other games, it's mostly about gathering and holding aggro, that isn't quite as cut and dry in Guild Wars and not nearly as predictable.

The Holy Trinity is still in place but not so firmly defined or executed.

But, these aren't bad things. It's actually nice not being slaved to a rather tired old formula.

I Might Avenge U · May 15, 2007, 05:03 AM // 05:03

Two things:

A) Guildwiki is your friend

http://gw.gamewikis.org/wiki/Main_Page

B) GuildCast is your friend:

http://www.guildcast.com/show/

I would listen to Episodes: 62, 65 a&b, 71

toddhd · May 15, 2007, 02:53 PM // 14:53

My first (and still main) char is an Elem/Me (and Elem/Mo, I switch a lot). I think my biggest mistake starting out was taking the Nuker idea too far. I ended up bringing along 8 fire damage spells with the thought in my head that with that much damage available to me, I'd be a force to reckon with.

Well, that just isn't so.

What I quickly came to understand was that with damage only spells, I had two major problems. First, my energy ran out in mere seconds, leaving me with my "you know what" in my hand, and just a wand for defense. Second, now I was monster food. Either I died quickly, or I tied up all the monks time and energy just to keep me alive while I stood there waiting for my energy to come back. It just wasn't good at all.

What is important in this game is balance. Yes, bring some fire spells, but maybe 3 total. I suggest flame, a ranged AoE like metoer shower, and a local Aoe like Phoenix. Bring something to raise your armor. Bring something to heal yourself. Bring something to manage your energy levels. And bring something defensive as opposed to offensive, or an elite of some kind. That's 7 spells, for the 8th, bring something mission specific. For example, rebirth is great if heavy casualties are expected. Or maybe an interrupt spell of some kind if there is lots of magic from the enemies.

Going in all "fire and brimstone" (or whatever element you choose) is just asking for it.

By the way, no matter what you do, Elems seem to take the most verbal abuse in the game. It seems like everyone has an opinion on what you should do, and what you can do, and you'll never please everyone all the time. So just ignore the comments and enjoy the game.

May 14, 2007, 06:50 PM // 18:50	#1
The Titan Ascalonian Squire Join Date: May 2007 Profession: D/	Wait, what? Hi there, I'm a long time lurker first time poster, this is going to be a short post as I'm not really good at long speeches. I've had Guild wars since release i quit after i completed it, I got into Factions beta and didn't like it at all. I was a pretty good player back then but now I'm washed up. I've started an Ele/MO and finding it fun to play GW once again (Still only first game) My real question is, what does it take to be a good player? I personally find this game to be very much harder to master then WoW. Oh and, I'm looking for somebody that can actually teach me how to play better, so if you can help please reply here. Thanks.

May 15, 2007, 02:53 PM // 14:53	#11
toddhd Ascalonian Squire Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Downingtown, PA Guild: Rite of Passage Profession: E/Me	My first (and still main) char is an Elem/Me (and Elem/Mo, I switch a lot). I think my biggest mistake starting out was taking the Nuker idea too far. I ended up bringing along 8 fire damage spells with the thought in my head that with that much damage available to me, I'd be a force to reckon with. Well, that just isn't so. What I quickly came to understand was that with damage only spells, I had two major problems. First, my energy ran out in mere seconds, leaving me with my "you know what" in my hand, and just a wand for defense. Second, now I was monster food. Either I died quickly, or I tied up all the monks time and energy just to keep me alive while I stood there waiting for my energy to come back. It just wasn't good at all. What is important in this game is balance. Yes, bring some fire spells, but maybe 3 total. I suggest flame, a ranged AoE like metoer shower, and a local Aoe like Phoenix. Bring something to raise your armor. Bring something to heal yourself. Bring something to manage your energy levels. And bring something defensive as opposed to offensive, or an elite of some kind. That's 7 spells, for the 8th, bring something mission specific. For example, rebirth is great if heavy casualties are expected. Or maybe an interrupt spell of some kind if there is lots of magic from the enemies. Going in all "fire and brimstone" (or whatever element you choose) is just asking for it. By the way, no matter what you do, Elems seem to take the most verbal abuse in the game. It seems like everyone has an opinion on what you should do, and what you can do, and you'll never please everyone all the time. So just ignore the comments and enjoy the game. Last edited by toddhd; May 15, 2007 at 02:59 PM // 14:59..

May 14, 2007, 07:00 PM // 19:00	#2
Brother Andicus Lion's Arch Merchant Join Date: May 2005 Location: Scotland Guild: The Illuminati	Being good at PvE doesn't really take much effort. Here's some basics. A) Use the radar to gague what you are likely to agro. Don't over agro. B) Learn to kite. If a melee monster is hitting on you, don't think "The monk can heal me". Start running. C) Think about what you want to achieve with your skillbar. Its very easy to lose sight of your objective and invest in too many attribute lines. D) Learn about as many skills in the game as you can. The more you know, the more it can be used to your advantage. E) No matter how good it may look, dont use mending.

May 14, 2007, 07:06 PM // 19:06	#3
Narcism Krytan Explorer Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Ottawa, ON, Canada Guild: Mostly Harmless Profession: W/	dont' be fixated on a certain skill combo/attribute/primary/secondary. or else you end up like the people in the soul reaping nerf thread.

May 14, 2007, 07:06 PM // 19:06	#4
Astro Pubes Frost Gate Guardian Join Date: May 2005 Location: Houston, Texas Guild: Gwen Is [EVIL]	Guild Wars was intended to be a more complex game than WoW. The creaters of GW made it a point that Skill>Time Grinding, but in all honesty you have to grind in GW to become a decent player and to understand the basic concepts of the game. I've been playing since release of Prophecies and tbh, it took me about 8 months before I even considered myself a decent player, now I like good challenges that press my game play even further. Some will say that the fastest way to understand the skill "synergy" and the way skill chains will work is to play PvP, which is in ways correct you'll learn how to properly chain skills to optimize their usage with one another. TBH, hardcore PvPers can make up some pretty crazy builds that work well and compliment each other. But, there are many PvEer's out there that have also figured out the skill "synergy" and they have created builds that work well against certain areas of the games, these builds are considered "Farming Builds". These players are also top notch build creaters, the ones that actually make the build. To answer your question about what it takes to be a good player... Time spent, Time played, do some research on builds, try out some already proven builds, try to create your own builds. I'm by no means claiming to know everything about the game, as every day i'm learning more and more myself and I have ~3800hours in 24 months under my belt. But if you want to be a good player, the best bet is to get in with good players and learn, do your homework on builds, find flaws with builds find skills that you can substitute into the build to make it better, and mostly, just play and have fun. Playing to have fun is what makes great players. Also, you might not have liked Factions, but now there's Nightfall. Of the 2 games I'd recommend Nightfall to you. But if you ever plan on becoming a competitive PvPer, I'd suggest to you no matter how much you didn't like Factions, to still consider buying it either via the online store PvP edition or going to your local game retailer and buying it from there. My $.02

May 14, 2007, 07:09 PM // 19:09	#5
lyra_song Hell's Protector Join Date: Oct 2005 Profession: R/Mo	Try everything. Explore. Experiment. Fail. Try again. Then you see how the game behaves, what works, what doesnt. I think all it takes to become a good player is the effort and willingness to learn.

May 15, 2007, 04:39 AM // 04:39	#9
Kuldebar Valiturus Desert Nomad Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Garden City, Idaho Guild: The Order of Relumination (TOoR) Profession: R/	Guild Wars PvE combat dynamics differ from every online game I have ever played. Not saying there aren't correlations but PvE Combat is paced and conducted very differently in Guild Wars. I remember the the learning curve I under went in Prophecies after coming over from DAoC, Horizons and WoW. The Skales would pile up on me and seemingly "call" for help from other clumps of skales in the area. It's all about intersecting circles of influence and how wide those circles may be. The radar map, of course, helps out tremendously but when combat starts mobs move and combat area drifts. In most other games, it's mostly about gathering and holding aggro, that isn't quite as cut and dry in Guild Wars and not nearly as predictable. The Holy Trinity is still in place but not so firmly defined or executed. But, these aren't bad things. It's actually nice not being slaved to a rather tired old formula.

May 15, 2007, 05:03 AM // 05:03	#10
I Might Avenge U Jungle Guide Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: California Profession: R/	Two things: A) Guildwiki is your friend http://gw.gamewikis.org/wiki/Main_Page B) GuildCast is your friend: http://www.guildcast.com/show/ I would listen to Episodes: 62, 65 a&b, 71